A New Dawn: Discussion

[Sadok]

Instant, yeah. I've done this a few times in the past.

[Groshnok]

Thanks!

[Kozgugore]

Notice in advance of the move in regards to the gold cap

As addressed earlier in this topic, you are unable to take more than 50k gold with you if you intend to transfer your character to another realm. If you have over 50k and do wish to bring more over to AD however, you can deposit any excess gold on our guild bank as of today. Withdrawing from the guild bank has been disabled for the time being, and I will make a note of every deposit made moments before I transfer the guild over to AD on the night from Sunday to Monday. So consider that your deadline, if you wish to make use of this opportunity. As soon as you've transferred your character over, you will naturally be reimbursed any of the gold you've deposited. That's a Papa Koz guarantee!

[Kozgugore]

Another notice, this time the final preparations in advance of the move!

When preparing for the realm transfer, please bear in mind the following points:

Addons
If you have a whole bunch of addons (or even just MRP/TRP), it might be a good idea to ensure these 'transfer' along with you. This can very easily be resolved by going into your main WoW folder and then go to W T F -> Account -> [Your account name] -> Defias Brotherhood. There, select your character's folder and copy/paste it to the Argent Dawn folder in the same directory as the Defias Brotherhood one. If you don't have an Argent Dawn folder there yet, you can simply create it with exactly that name and paste your character's folder there. That should be all there is to it!

Gold
As stated in the previous post, withdrawing from the bank has now been disabled, for those that wish to make use of the guild bank's ability to take along an unlimited amount of gold (as opposed to the very limited 50k gold for each character). Make sure to deposit your gold before Monday 0:00 to ensure your gold will travel along with the guild. Once you've made the transfer yourself, you'll naturally get exactly the same amount back. If you happen to be too late to make use of this option, you can also consider a method previously mentioned in this thread by buying a whole lot of blueprints from the garrison vendor and selling them again once you arrive on AD. Do bear in mind that I'm not entire sure if this method has been properly tested, but it's an alternative to the guild bank.

Most importantly: The move itself
To ensure the guild arrives on AD in time (due to any possible queues for Battle.net services), I will be transferring the guild itself around Monday 8 June 0:00. So that's the night from Sunday to Monday, one entire day prior to the officially planned move (which would be Tuesday 9 June 0:00). This is simply a safety precaution, and will leave everyone on DB in a "skeleton guild" throughout Monday. However, this does not mean I expect guild members to travel along with it. As mentioned, the guild's members are still planned to move on Tuesday 9 June 0:00.

You are welcome to move sooner (as of Monday 0:00) already if this is more convenient for you, but I would advise against it both due to there still being an event on Monday 20:30 which I'm sure Rashka would be grateful for people to attend, but also in case the actual guild's transfer to AD has been slowed down in Blizzard's transfer services, meaning you would lose your rank and reputation if you were to transfer before the guild itself will have been moved. To this end, ensure you do not /gquit the guild before you leave DB. You should be placed right back into the guild upon your move to AD, when you are still in the guild upon transferring your character.


That should be all! If you do have any more questions or inquiries, don't hesitate to place them here.

[Kozgugore]

Fixed a little mistake that turned the W T F folder into summer pudding due to forum shenanigans. I do like summer pudding, however..

[Umaua]

Also to note. TRP3 descriptions follow realm transfer. I know this since mine still says "Argent Dawn" even if I am on Defias. This only shows to you though, so its no issue. But you just need to reselect the proper profile after the transfer.

[Rashka]

A note on the gold - you can buy the garrison building scrolls in your garrison, they sell for the exactly same price. They're 50k in all I think.

[Claws]

Sorry confused not hard i know but there you go.
When we go over and people have a toon already in place with there name.
Does there Defias toon just take it's place or do we have to delete the Argent toon just before the move over.
I have to change my toon name but it's not far of the same thanks to help from others on here.
So I guess I will have to ask for enrollment to tribe when i get there.

[Therak]

If there is someone with the same name when you transfer over, you get to choose a new name when you arrive. If it's your toon, you should be able to delete the toon in question, and then pick the name of the deleted toon after the transfer

[Sadok]

A message from Hikka of the Shatterskull Marauders that I've been asked to share:

21:50:47 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: You there?
21:50:51 To [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood]: I am, yes!
21:51:33 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: i need to log out but i would like to deliver a message for you and all the red blades
21:51:38 To [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood]: Okey dokey!
21:51:46 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: aight, pasteing it now
21:52:00 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: The Red Blades were the first guild to welcome us (not counting elves who picked up us from shores) to the RP community. A real bunch of excellent and brilliant RPers with characters unique and imaginative. I always loved RPing with Red Blades eventhough
21:52:14 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: ICly Hikka clashed with them few times due to cultural differences and her being a psycopath. It was always fun to RP with them especially as Hikka, as she tried her best to honour the orcs and not upset them by repressing her own unique characteristics
21:52:25 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: and antics as best as she could.
21:52:35 To [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood]: That's really nice, thanks! Been very enjoyable RPing with yourself and all the Marauders too.
21:52:44 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: OorRB was also undistiputedly one of the cornerstone holders of the RP on the Horde's side, and big respects for doing that. The way they made lots of events where other guilds were welcome was awesomeness.
21:52:57 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: Wether it was was world RP-PVP, RP events (battles) or just RP events like Kosh'harg festival, it was always fun, great oppotunities to RP and good times!
21:53:09 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: Like I said earlier, Red Blades is full of brilliant and excellent RPers, but two names from RB I have to honour with special mentioning: Sadok and Krogon.
21:53:28 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: #1 Sadok Sharptongue. Damn Hikka likes that old pervert and his sense of humour made me laugh both IC and OOC many times we have met. A brilliant character indeed! Also I liked when Sadok was brought back alive during the Northern rebellion
21:53:38 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: (if I remember right), ICly Hikka disapproved this at first but then just let it go and stopped giving a shit, I mean come on, it's SADOK! OOCly that was fun thing to do!
21:53:50 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: Krogon Devilstep. Hikka always liked the quiet and seemingly calm Krogon, and was fascinated that she never got truly find out what goes inside this orc's mind. Later mentioned also fascinated me OOCly. A Great, great character. Well RP'd, Devilstep, well
21:53:57 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: well RP'd.
21:54:08 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: For my last words on this topic I will say this; Orcs of the Red Blade was a unique and excellent guild that brought good times and fun RP experiences through out their history in DB for many, many people.
21:54:21 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: If Red Blades feel that they want to try new RP opportunities and adventures in Argent Dawn, I wish the best of luck! May your guild flourish and bask in the glory of defeating alliance and making further victories... FOR THE HORDE!
21:54:31 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: With honour and respect, Hikka
21:54:36 [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood] whispers: *salute*
21:54:44 To [Hikká-DefiasBrotherhood]: Thank you very much for those kind words! I hope everything goes well with you and your guild and DB in general. It's been a pleasure.

[Kozgugore]

(And for those worried about the guild master: Gakrath thing: That's to choose who becomes the guild master of the skeleton guild that will be left behind on DB. Not the one on AD, as Gakrath is my alt who will stay behind on DB for just a little while longer.)

[Okiba]

[Vezara]

WARNING: Before you transfer, make sure to pick up all completed work orders in your garison! I had 21 completed work orders from all my buildings, and they were all gone when I arrived on AD.

EDIT: Seems like you only lose work orders from small (profession) buildings.

[Sadok]

Anyway, now that the move to AD is well under-way and the moment of possible danger has passed, I'd like to clear the record personally about some of the things that have been going on the last few weeks. There have been a couple of cryptic allusions to certain individuals taking parting shots at OotRB after we announced we were moving realms, and while you've seen a lot of that in our recruitment threads, there was a larger iceberg lurking beneath those waters.

A lot of e-ink has been spilled about how to restore DB to its glory, with one thread opened marketing Defias as "the Friendly RP server". Just want to share how friendly this RP server had become as of late.

For those otherwise unaware, Orcs of the Red Blade have been a cornerstone of the Defias community for nearly ten years, and after a lot of fond memories, we agreed to move to Argent Dawn for various reasons. This was not a cynical ploy or server warfare, but a decision based on the feedback of 40 members and a consultation phase with many difficult conversations, and the pros and cons carefully weighed. We agreed that on balance, the best decision for the future of the guild and its members was AD, but it was not an easy decision by any means.

The crux of this decision, which transformed a realm transfer from an impossibility to a reality, was crowdfunding. I personally felt guilty at the notion of cash-strapped friends and guildees being left behind, and the officer-team considered making provisions without that included would have been detrimental both to the community vibe we've tried to cultivate here and the long-term success of the guild.

The reaction amongst the general Defias community to our move was heartwarming. From PvPers to PvEers to RPers, I've been touched to see so many of them wishing us well, even if we were perfect strangers or worse yet, had disputes in the past. It's those good apples who are a credit to the community, and it's the good people on DB who I'll miss long after the move.

What I won't miss, however, are the fairweather friends in the Horde RP community who have opportunistically turned against OotRB the moment we announced the transfer -- supposed IC allies and OOC friends who we've cooperated with for years, who only now are glad to see the back of us. I'd rather not name and shame directly, so I present the following quotes without their authors, but each one is the GM of a well-known RP guild or other leading figure in the community. These aren't forum trolls, these are the actual people running the efforts trying to get new RPers to Defias.

• "It just becomes clear that OotRB is ignorant to it's own issues, through not having taken the time to actually attempt to view the guild from an outside perspective."
• "Why would we be going all "we're so sorry to see you leave" when quite frankly, we're not. It's a shame to lose roleplayers, but lately I've not been seeing anything good from ORB really."
• "its a shame but tbf orb have kept themselves to themselves for a while so it wont make a great deal of difference"
• "Your officer team is incompetent, your members are a fucking mess. Your guild is a fucking mess."
• "The only thing moving to AD will do for you all is protect you from gankers. If you don't adjust your attitudes to roleplay, you will find yourselves falling apart. You'll be on a new server where everyone is one of those pesky outsiders the majority if you tend to ignore Then you won't last long."
• "We have to get over ourselves a bit and play with the other kids. On AD, RP isn't guild-based. It's random and between everyone from any guild. It's a shame you guys don't want to adjust and be part of that and will instead just run off to "greener pastures."
• "I'd say it's time you people woke the fuck up, but you never will. You're far too stupid to understand something so basic. You've brought all of the shit you get, on yourself."

Half of the criticism was that we did too much. The other half, ironically, was that we didn't do enough. But it's clear enough that it wouldn't have mattered what we did or didn't do -- some individuals would have been unhappy no matter what.

One would get the idea that the DB RP community is some sort of cult from which you must be forcibly excommunicated if you leave. No wonder so many have already left. Indeed, the remnants of the community were so outraged a guild would dare leave, they renamed their chat to "Horde Leaders (OrB Sucks)" then kicked an RP guild's officer from the chat when she dared to invite a former Red Blade who reputation was being savaged, so he could at least defend himself -- reducing that person to tears with nasty OOC whispers.

Oh, but it gets better. Because the emergency meeting held by the Horde RP leaders to try and mobilise after we announced our departure (even though they insist it changes nothing and they wish we left earlier) continued to show where the priorities of the community are:

• Doubting that we'd ever been nice enough to successfully raise money for our members: "Yeah, they can 'raise funds' all they want. Few people are actually going to donate to other peoples transfers unless they're best buds."
• Praying for the guild to split apart: "Exactly. OrB is desolving. let's try to welcome who of them is staying and integrate them as best as possible."
• Outright poaching our members before we're even gone: "I think we all can agree to that. Do we know if there is someway we could approach them before ORB leaves to start the integration?"
  
• More poaching: "It's a bit of corpse flaying, some might say, but not picking up thos RP'ers from OrB would be a damn shame."
• Deciding to not bother RPing with us on our remaining time on DB, despite us inviting them to farewell events: "I personally see little point in even bothering with doing any real interaction with ORB itself, as they are soon gone."
• Posting on our private forums to try and convince people to stay: "Na, just put it out there for those wanting to stay there are other options. I mean as little as a post on the forums or so, or maybe a guild alt for those of you in it if theres any"

Of course, we took reciprocal actions to prevent this, including revoking forum access for some former OotRB members now leading well-known DB Horde RP guilds, and deliberately keeping a little distance from the new Orgrimmar RP hub (although that would have become a necessity either way due to our new cross-realm members who can't visit DB Org).

And you can find the entire log here in all its glory:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7AWJFvzKhIxT0xWWnMyZUlubDA/view

There are also other chat-logs I've been passed from private guild chats where individual members of our guild are mocked and badmouthed, with some of the people in said chat saying they're glad to see us gone while in the same breath wondering if DB can survive without us.

So what's the moral of this story? You can belong to a server for a decade, you can create thousands of RP events for your member-core, organise RP-PvP campaigns, casual RP initiatives, maintain RP guild lists, direct people in trade and chat-channels to RP guild websites and act as a friendly, accommodating ambassador to Defias. And the moment you announce you're leaving, the remaining community have already disowned you, started savaging you with issues they never had the courage to raise prior, and begin planning to overtly poach your members to sabotage the guild.

As someone who has put years of my free-time into this guild, I'm personally annoyed by anyone looking to deliberately undo a lot of the hard work by dozens of people in making this guild as large and successful as it is. You could perhaps surmise that if they spent less time obsessing over the ruin of OotRB and more time on their own RP guilds and initiatives, DB wouldn't be in half the trouble it is.

The one major exception throughout all of this has been Shatterskull Marauders, who have acted fairly and decently as an officer-team. But besides that? Argent Dawn of course is vast, and there is good RP and bad RP, good people and drama-mongers -- but never do such a small number of toxic, bitter individuals wield such influence. That's why I can no longer recommend DB to others on public forums, regardless of the waxing or waning of its RP population.

As this is a private forum, I'd appreciate not spreading this topic any further beyond this thread. But as an officer-team, we've been holding back publicly to make sure our last days on DB weren't marred with horrible drama, and now it's time to stop bottling it in and let it out.

Thanks.

[Okiba]

...you should just post it on the defiasRP forum.

Really. It would shut them all up, as they need to be.

I can't help but agree with it all though.

Edit: I would also recommend those individuals have thier alts 'scoured' from our rosters, on both servers.