Hello,
Got a few rogue questions and would like to hear back from anyone who knows a bit about this topic. I have a mate on a different server and we were having a debate about whats better. He is a 70 rogue with shadowstep spec he recently joined a raiding guild hes on pve server. I also have a 70 rogue.
First - Whats better for end game pve raiding - Combat spec or Shadowstep spec?
Second - Whats the best spec for end game pve overall?
Third - Would a shadowstep rogue beat a combat spec rogue in damage output in end game raiding?
Look forward to hearing from you.
It all comes down to how you play and you weapon set up.
Shadow step Aghhhhh hate it waste of talent points getting a talent that is only useful on cloths. (My own opinion).
Ok you can stun a warrior or a Paladin with it but as soon as they come out of the stun and if you have not locked them up say good bye.
Do not see how it can be used in instance runs you will be taking the agro tankers job away from the warrior and last about 2 seconds.
PVP raid it has it good points but it puts the rogue in a vulnerable position ie: in amongst the cloths with no way to get away from them.
Rogue is a DPS fighter get in quick do the damage and get away even if means leaving your pray for others to finish off.
Poison is a talent tree that gets forgot by many but against the Pals, and healers it can cause a lot of trouble.
Hit them with wound poison and crippling and you get a slow moving target that cannot heal.
In PVE hit your target with hemo and poison and spam it.
So in my own opinion keep away from shadow step for end PVE and go for a combat hybrid.
I like to move about with out being seen and having an escape route ready hence, I go for prep.
((Other wise why be a rogue if you can not move about with out being seen)).
My build at the moment.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhLZ0xEzbE00bZxMe0MhRo
Have been this for long time now and it suits me not all but as I say personal choice.
However, may be a time for a change.
Cool thanks for getting back so quick. I wouldnt use shadowstep spec on my rogue. Was just trying to get others views because I think ss isnt very good for end game pve and was trying to convince my friend. Hes more into pve end game raiding so i was saying a combat spec was the way to go for that.
I was using this build until I gave my rogue up for a move to Defias. I always pvped with my rogue and found this build to be good.
Assassination (30 points)
3/3 Improved Eviscerate
5/5 Malice
3/3 Ruthlessness
3/3 Improved Backstab
1/1 Relentless Strikes
5/5 Lethality
2/2 Fleet Footed
1/1 Cold Blood
2/2 Quick Recovery
5/5 Seal Fate
Subtlety (31 points)
5/5 Master of Deception
5/5 Opportunity
5/5 Camouflage
3/3 Initiative
3/3 Improved Ambush
3/3 Setup
2/2 Elusiveness
1/1 Preparation
3/3 Master of Subtlety
1/1 Premeditation
Not that good with comps so I just put it like this rather than link it ;D.
The Classic rogue build still works well. 8)
I have a 54 rogue myself and I level as shadowstep. The only reason im doing this is because I enjoy the spec the most. If you have a good weapon you can easily take out 50-60% of your opponent's life if you crit ambush, with the spec I have now I got 99% crit on ambush after killing something, combined with 50% extra damage from talents. Preparation also gives you more chances to activate your I-win-skills.
Yet at level 70 -> PvP changed, at 60 pvp was about the hardest nuke, who could kill who first but at level 70 it's all about outlasting your opponent. this is why subtlety at level 70 is kinda bad. In arena your ambush and 'big nuke' are easily outhealed and after that you are trapped out of stealth and you're damage is just low (compared to combat that is).
As for PvE: My main's guild is starting mount hyjal this week and all rogues I met so far have been combat. Because combat gives the biggest damage when you are not stealthed. and because boss fights last 10 minutes out of stealth damage >>>>> stealth damage.
Hope this helped 8)
For PvE i`ll suggest to find rogue build`s in Nihilum guild.
For PvP - find top rated arena teams and you`ll get the picture (but dont try 5x5 - not many rogues there)
Quote from: Claws on December 18, 2007, 04:28:25 PM
It all comes down to how you play and you weapon set up.
Shadow step Aghhhhh hate it waste of talent points getting a talent that is only useful on cloths. (My own opinion).
Ok you can stun a warrior or a Paladin with it but as soon as they come out of the stun and if you have not locked them up say good bye.
Do not see how it can be used in instance runs you will be taking the agro tankers job away from the warrior and last about 2 seconds.
Think outside the box :) Just because you're behind your target doesn't mean you have to use ambush, Garrote is lovely thing. Imagine this; You spot a warrior in BG, sneak up on him, Shadowstep + Premed macro (makes you cast them both a the same time) [2CP, 3 after next patch], Garrote [3-4CP], Hemo[4-5CP], Rupture, vanish. The warrior will now face a total of 2-3k damage that totaly ignores his armor. When the DoTs start to wear of you go for him again.
For PvE you can use it before a 5CP rupture to make it tick for some numbers, here's a Shadowstep PvE build with imp. SnD http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/rogue/talents.html?0000000000000000000002053050000050000000000005500231002301211501351
However I'm not sure if SHadowstep would be able to compeat with combat for pure DPS, however it brings Hemo which increases raid DPS by a fair bit and thanks to DIrty Deeds your DPS will increase in long fights where mobs are below 35% for a longer time.
But like you said, it's down to playstyle and what you like yourself, I leveled as Hemo all the way to 70 and switched to combat just recently, I might do some more damage in the long run but it's oh so much mroe boring.
Nice pan.
But the only thing i do not like about any of them type of builds is timers.
Waiting for the cool down before you can repeat the move again.
Ok you can use prep but then you on cool down for that also.
Not much good in the mid of a raid when it is going off all around you.
One on one yes great.